Lies my doctor told me with Dr Ken Berry

Allan (02:12):
Dr. Barry, welcome to 40+ Fitness.

Dr. Berry (02:15):
Hey Allan, thanks so much for having me.

Allan (02:17):
You know, I've read your book, Lies My Doctor Told Me, I've heard you speak a few times about it as well, and I follow you on social media. So I'm really familiar with your messaging and your approach, which I think is really comfortable. You're a down-home kinda guy. And this book was written in that same kind of style that I would expect from you. This is a, you know, here's some things to think about. Here's some things to do. And I really like the approach you took with this book. Thank you. Now the title, Lies My doctor Told Me, it's a compelling title. It's, you know, it's out there. It's like, okay, well why would my doctor lie to me? Or, you know, is my doctor really lying me? What's going on there? You know, why, why do our doctors had it wrong?

Dr. Berry (03:03):
Well, if you go to get a haircut and your barber tells you, you know, you should eat more whole grains, then your barber has no fiduciary duty to your health, to your nutrition. He just has to cut your hair well. Right? And so that would just be a myth or misconception or a misstatement. But when someone is taking notes to do no harm and who has taken it upon themselves to drape the stethoscope over their shoulder, I believe they should be held to a higher standard. I believe that they should go over and above and go out of their way to actually know about the care and feeding of the human animal. And that's why I chose to use the word lie instead of myth because it's actually, it's legally a lie if your doctor gives you bad medical advice.

Dr. Berry (03:56):
That's legally looked upon in the eyes of the law as a criminal act. And that's why I chose to use that word. Even though the first publisher I thought about going with did not like that. He wanted me to change that. And that's why I initially self-published the book and then Victor Bell publishing later was happy to put out a second edition. But that's why I use that word and I understand strong language. But I think at this stage of the game, at this stage of metabolic disease where it's actually more common in the United States to have at least some of the precursors of metabolic syndrome, thats not. It's actually more common to be overweight or obese or morbidly obese than it is to have a normal body mass index. I think the time for kid gloves and, and syrupy sweet messages are over. I think it's time to be real and be honest and call things what they are.

Allan (04:51):
Yeah. You know, I was an auditor in a previous life and when I first came through, they didn't want to use the word fraud because they felt it was too out there. So we use the term irregularities and after things got bad with the WorldCom and all that kind of stuff, there was this fundamental switch where we said, no, we actually have to start using the word fraud because people are not paying attention. They think in irregularities where someone just made a mistake and we're like, no, and irregularities where someone actually did something wrong, yeah, on purpose. So let's call it fraud. Now my doctor, when I go to him and he tells me I need to get rid of the egg yolk because that's got cholesterol and it's bad for me, still believes that in his heart of hearts that I don't need the dietary cholesterol.

Allan (05:35):
So in a, in a sense as I'm talking to them, it is, it is a lie. Okay. It's a liable mission or a lie of just him not getting the education. Now doctors, they're responsible to go get CPE or I don't know what you guys call it, continuing education units, as a public account I had to do that. I had to do at least 40 hours a week, a year as well. Personal trainer, I have to go for about four days of training. Pick what training I do, why, why are doctors not looking at this crisis of obesity and saying I might want to go to a few things that are going to help me answer these questions and why my patients are getting sicker.

Dr. Berry (06:15):
Probably the main reason that your doctor thinks that he's doing an okay job is because we're taught in medical school and residency as physicians that all patients are noncompliant. And so when he tells you, you know, you need to avoid the egg yolks and eat lots of whole grains and lots of fruits and vegetables, he doesn't think you're actually doing that. He thinks you're laying on the couch eating honey buns and Doritos. That's just the physician mindset. We don't think that patients actually follow our advice, although we're duty bound to give advice. And so I really think positions, they should start falling into two camps. And I think both of both camps are perfectly moral and ethical. And so camp one would be a doctor who's just not interested in nutrition, who doesn't care what I owed her about it. That doctor should just tell patients, look, I don't know anything about human nutrition. All I know how to do is prescribe the medicine and order tests, and order, you know, diagnostic imaging exams.

Dr. Berry (07:17):
I don't know anything about what you should and shouldn't eat. I mean, look at me, I'm 20 pounds overweight, you know, I'm pre diabetic, obviously, I don't know. So if a doctor prefaced any conversation about health and nutrition with that, that'd be perfectly moral and honest because patients look up to their doctor and they expect that their doctor knows. And I think that's a reasonable expectation that your doctor should know about the proper care and feeding of of human beings. And so if you're a doctor and you're listening to this and you're like, I just don't care about nutrition, I don't care if ketos right or again, I don't care, then tell your patient that. Disclose that at the beginning of the interview so that if you do give nutrition advice in the future, they'll know, Oh Hey, this guy doesn't even care about that.

Dr. Berry (08:03):
He's not going to eat. Bro. This is probably wrong. But if you don't put out a disclaimer like that as a doctor, then your patient, there's a bit of blind belief because when it all comes down to it, the patient either has to believe you or not. And if their health is at risk they're going to believe a trusted health expert, which is what a doctor's considered to be. And so the second school of doctors should be doctors who are actively reading and researching and looking and studying about human nutrition because obviously the reason that we're all overweight and metabolically ill is not because we're laying around. I mean there's actually research that shows that we're just as active now as we were in the 18 hundreds back in the 18 hundreds there was no obesity. I mean, you'd have to search all over town to find the one guy who's overweight back then.

Dr. Berry (08:58):
So you can't say it's like an activity. Some people want to blame it on food additives, some people want to blame it on jet fuel in the water. You know, there's all these, these scapegoats. But in the end it's the food we're eating. That's what it is. And the doctor needs to be knowledgeable about that or shut up about that.

Allan (09:14):
Yeah, it was interesting. My doctor, I really liked him, but he had a nutritionist on staff so he would just say, you know, we're gonna look at your blood work and this and this, but here's a nutritionist to talk to you about the nutrition side of this.

Dr. Berry (09:29):
Yeah, that's much more ethical and much more consistent to just admit, I don't know a damn thing about nutrition. I'm going to send you to a nutritionist. Hopefully they do cause that should be the message because often they do not.

Allan (09:41):
Well, he's still put a little bit of tidbits in there. Like, you know, the egg yolk thing. And so he had his own kind of methodology is on approach. His own thought process that was actually in conflict with what his nutritionist was saying, but at the same time I had the information presented to me and I felt like that was a pretty good deal. So if we don't feel comfortable getting that information, we need to, we need to stick it out ourselves or find a better doctor.

Dr. Berry (10:05):
Yes.

Allan (10:06):
You know, over the years, you know, things will come up and then they'll rise back up, they'll go back down. And so kind of the two, I'm going to call themwarring sides because it almost is tribal is you have one camp and then I'm calling both of these Olympic elimination diets. That's kind of how I look at them. One is the vegan and the other side is the carnival.

Dr. Berry (10:28):
Yes.

Allan (10:28):
And both of them, you know, they'll put science out there and say, this is why our diets right. Can you kind of just walk us through, I know you're a little bit more over to the carnivore side of this conversation. So that's why I wanted to have you on here. Cause I just had a vegan on a few weeks ago. And so I wanted to kind of bring this in and say, okay, let's talk about what the science is really telling us.

Dr. Berry (10:49):
Yes. And so I think that a real whole food vegan diet is better then the standard American diet. And so, but now if the vegan or vegetarian diet you're talking about is including lots of processed whole grains and lots of industrial vegetable seed oils and lots of sugar where they're added sugar or natural sugar, then it can be almost as bad as the standard American diet.

Dr. Berry (11:17):
I think that since the beginning of humanity as a species, we have eaten as much fatty meat as we can get our hands on. This is a, this is documented in the paleo anthropological record without doubt. We're able to go back and look at bones, whether they're 10 years old or a hundred thousand years old and look at the bones and the teeth. And we can actually do something called stable isotope analysis. And we can look at the carbon, the nitrogen in the strontium and other elemental analysis. And we can tell without doubt what these people ate. That's not up for debate. And so if being vegan says that we've always eaten a plant based diet and we, we've eaten animals if we were starving or had to, that's exactly backwards. And the anthropological record is very, very clear on that. That's really not up for debate at all.

Dr. Berry (12:11):
If you ask any paleoanthropologists, they'll tell you, we ate as much fatty meat we can get our hands on only we ate vegie but when we wanted to or when we had to. And so is a vegan diet less inflammatory than the standard American diet? Yes, absolutely. Can someone switched from the standard American diet to a vegan diet and improve their health markers are less than inflammation? Absolutely. No doubt about it. But the problem with the vegan diet is they always compare their results to somebody eating the standard American diet. And so that would kind of be like somebody, you know, comparing crack addicts to marijuana addicts. Yeah. Marijuana is a little less bad, but that doesn't make, it good at least for most people. Does that make sense?

Allan (13:00):
Yeah absolutely.

Dr. Berry (13:01):
I think the problem is with their paradigm. I think vegans are very earnest and honest and I think they fully believe what they're saying and I do think there are benefits of removing all the added sugars and the soft drinks and all the grains and all of the highly processed highly inflammatory industrial seed oils from your diet.

Dr. Berry (13:23):
Huge benefits from that. And so vegan may be where you land up. But I don't think you're going to find optimal health there. I think you're going to find health improvement, but unless you continue to move along the nutrition spectrum until you add enough fatty meat to your diet, enough liver, enough bone marrow, enough things like that to get all of the vital nutrition that a human body needs, and the human mind, you're just not going to have optimal health. And indeed we've seen in the last few years, many high level vegans come out and say, you know, I had to add some salmon back to my diet or I had to add eggs back to my diet because although some things were doing well, I just might, mentally I wasn't doing well or energy wise, I wasn't doing well. And you've seen that multiple, multiple times, but I haven't seen many high level fatty meat, heavy Kito influencers or carnival influencer say, you know, I had to add some kale back into my diet too. I just wasn't feeling good. You just don't say that.

Allan (14:25):
Yeah. You know, every time I see a study, they love throwing out the cancer word. Vegans really love that when they're talking cause they're like, read meat's going to give you cancer. But every time I've seen a study that even goes close to that, it says, you know, red meat and processed meat, they have to pair those together. They don't ever kind of segregate those out to see that one might be a confounder of the other. And then they'll go into the, well, when you cook your meat on a grill. Your doing this thing to it. So there's this, this battle there of do we include red meat in our diet? Is it bad for us?

Dr. Berry (15:04):
Yeah. And I actually have a chapter in the book about red meat and about processed meat. All of the nutrition data that's been collected, all the nutritional research that's been done is based on food frequency questionnaires, which I'm sure you and many of your followers are familiar with. And so you would go and ask a person, how many cups of ribs have you eaten in the last six weeks? How many, how many pounds of brisket have you eaten? And so the average person who survied in these studies is not a carnivore, right? Allan? So they're not just, so when they hamburger, they're not just eating hamburgers. When they eat a hot dog, they're not just eating hot dogs and nothing else. They're also eating the ketchup and the bun that's from just highly processed wheat, they're eating the French fries, which is pure starch fried in the inflammatory industrial seed oils.

Dr. Berry (15:56):
They're eating all of the accompaniments of that hamburger because there's not many people like me who would just go to Wendy's and order six hamburger patties and put some mustard on them and that'd be their meal. Most people in these surveys are not doing that, and so you cannot tease out, okay, yeah, this person ate more meat, but what that really meant was that person was going to Wendy's or McDonald's more and getting the super Whopper jumbo supersize meal and drinking a 40 ounce Coke or diet Coke with that little piece of meat that they were eating. That doesn't prove anything about meat. Does that make sense? I mean, that question is totally cloudy and there's no way to tease that out.

Dr. Berry (16:37):
The only way to ever do this is to just take 50 people and put them on just a pure carnivore diet and 50 people and put them on a pure vegan diet and then 50 more and let them eat just whatever the hell and then follow those people for 10 years or 15 years. That's the only way this question's ever going to be settled. And I doubt seriously anybody really wants to do that study. The carnivores don't have, we don't have the millions of dollars needed to put on that kind of study. The vegans, I guarantee you don't want to put on that study because they're afraid of what the results will show and that's why you don't see that type of study done by Harvard school of public health or any of the others huge plant based nutrition authorities. They're never going to do that study,

Allan (17:19):
Which then puts us in this, in this paradigm of okay, there are people who've been carnival or for a number of years. There are people who have been vegan for a number of years and if we start paying attention to their health health outcomes, that should give us at least some data and then we can do the experiment ourselves. If we feel comfortable that we're not doing something to harm ourselves, you know, we don't want to run out there and start a way of eating when we start watching other people, you know. And one of the things you brought up earlier, which I think is really, really important is ah, fueling our brain are actually building our brain. The brain is not made out of plant matter.

Dr. Berry (18:01):
Right, not at all. It's made out of pure fat, cholesterol and some collagen to hold it all together. I mean, the brain is a, is a fatty organ and the brain uses 20 to 25% of your total energy each day, even though it's very small in comparison to other huge organs like your liver and your muscles and your skin. But so much of mental disease comes from diet. So much of suffering, so much of fatigue, so much of mental fog, forgetfulness, early onset symptoms of dementia. All of this stuff is coming from the diet. And one of the Blue Cross Blue Shield organizations just published a kind of an alert saying, Hey guys, to doctors, the incidents of dementia in 30 and 40 year olds is up 300% over the last few years.

Dr. Berry (18:56):
Could you guys maybe look into that and see what's going on? Cause you know, Blue Cross is a huge health insurer and they're looking at this like there's no way we're going to be able, I mean if this becomes common for people in their forties and fifties to be disabled with dementia, everybody's going to go broke. And so you might want to look into this. So what went from being a very rare thing a hundred years ago? You know, great grandmother might have a little bit of forgetfulness, but there were not 30 something and 40 something year old people running around with Alzheimer's dementia a hundred years ago. That just did not happen. So even if you went back and ate what I just called the a hundred year diet, literally went back and found a couple of cookbooks from 1920 and ate only what was in those you would do better then you would do with the standard American diet.

Dr. Berry (19:45):
We've really got to wake up or we're going to be faced with not only a personal health crisis, both mental and physical, but a nationwide in a worldwide just health catastrophe where there is no amount of money that's going to help keep people well. It's just, it's going to all fall apart if we don't start feeding the human animal the proper human diet. That has to happen at some point or the problem will become unsolvable.

Allan (20:14):
Yeah. You know, it is something that, you put your head around this idea that what you put in your mouth is a building block for what your body is going to be made out of.

Dr. Berry (20:26):
Yeah.

Allan (20:26):
And if you're not getting well, we obviously know if we don't give ourselves adequate nutrition then we start seeing those deficiencies and that usually manifests in some form of problem for us. But there's this kind of thing going on in the background, particularly like with building our brain, with building our bones, with building our muscles with building all of us. If we're not putting the right material there, we're making ourselves out of fluff.

Dr. Berry (20:50):
Exactly. If I took you Allan and I locked you in my barn, and this is a common analogy I use, and I fed you nothing but ribeye, steak and beef liver and that's and water and salt and that literally is all I gave you. Fresh meat, fresh liver and water and salt. You understand you could live in my barn for decades and you would not develop any vitamin or mineral deficiencies. And I'm happy to talk about vitamin C if you want to because there've been carnivores for 20/25 years whose skin and teeth look amazing. They don't have scurvy. And so there's more to the vitamin C story, then you have to eat lots of fruits.

Dr. Berry (21:30):
But if I took a, took you again in an alternate life and locked you in my barn and fed you nothing but plants and on either one of these diets you can't have supplements. You can only eat food. So you could have any plant from anywhere in the world, from the, from Australia to Panama to the Himalayan mountains, any berry, any herbs, any roots you wanted. It wouldn't be many months if not maybe a year. You would start to develop serious fatty acid deficiencies and serious amino acid deficiencies. You would start to get sick, you would suffer and you would die early from eating that diet that was restricted of the vitamins and minerals that you can only find in meat, in any meaningful quantity. And so again, that's another research study that will never be done. We're never going to lock 50 people in our barn and feed them carnivores and 50 and feed them vegan cause it's very unethical to lock people in your barn first and foremost, you can't do That.

Allan (22:26):
Well, If you have a gym in there. And I get Netflix, I'm probably good to come.

Dr. Berry (22:31):
Yeah. If you had a gym and wifi. Exactly.

Allan (22:36):
Well, you know, one of the things, I was interviewing one week, one vegan and one of the concepts he came up with is because I on the one side, you're like, well, you're not getting B12 you supplement with, and he's in his response was, well, carnivores have to supplement with statins.

Dr. Berry (22:52):
No. Yeah, there is n such thing is a Staten deficiency. Statin medications are one of the most dangerous medications that a doctor can prescribe. And I'm not saying there's never an instance where a statin might have more benefit than harm, but 99% of the time a statin drug, and this is Levacor, Zocor, Crestor, and there's a couple of new ones, 99% of the time they do more harm than good. If you take your statin faithfully for 20 years, you might add three days to your life. In the process of that, you've lowered your testosterone, you've raised your blood sugar, you've raised your levels of inflammation, you've increased your muscle fatigue, your muscle aches and pains. Your life has gotten worse. Just the, just kind of your wellbeing measurement has gotten worse. You've lowered your testosterone, which is uniformly bad. You raised your blood sugar, which is uniformly bad. And really, the only way that the statins work is with an antiinflammatory effect that they also appear to have, which is well known in the literature. It has nothing to do with load lowering, total cholesterol. That's not how they give you those three extra days of life that you got for paying 20 years worth of copays.

Allan (24:12):
Yeah, I don't, my cholesterol naturally runs kinda on the high end. And so that, you know, when those scares come out, you know, my doctor sees my cholesterol, he's, he's always kinda trying to push me in that direction and I just, I just always kind of pull back and say, you know, I've tried them. I don't like how I feel on them. They mess with my muscles. He says, well, we'll just try a different one. I'm like, no, I'm not going there anymore. I've seen enough. I don't believe that's going to be, I don't believe my cholesterol numbers is really a big deal because my high cholesterol relative to my total cholesterol is actually really, really good. My high cholesterol relative to my triglycerides, really, really good. So those ratios to me are what I want to see versus just this big number.

Allan (24:55):
Now doctors in their standard of care are probably still going to have that conversation with you. And you have to talk to your doctor and realize, you know, there are some things that you could probably do to lower it, but it's a building block for testosterone. It, statins, also don't they affect the CoQ10, which damages the heart?

Dr. Berry (25:13):
Yeah.

Allan (25:13):
So if you're going to be on a statin you probably gonna want to supplement with COQ 10, just to make sure.

Dr. Berry (25:19):
Yeah.

Allan (25:20):
So you know, like you said, there's not an absolute for any one of us to say that we wouldn't benefit from it, but it's just something that you're putting a foreign substance in your body and it's causing some other side effects and you have to weigh that and let that pay.

Dr. Berry (25:36):
And just the, the vegan argument of, well, those people are going to develop a statin deficiency. A statin is a patented molecule that's made in the factory. And so you understand their mindset a little bit. They're like, either you're going to have to take supplements made in a factory or you're going to have to take a statin made in a factory. What about a hundred thousand years ago? I mean, how did we get by? How did, how did we prosper and flourish? I mean, we became the alpha species on this planet a long time before people started advocating just eating plants or started advocating patented fake molecules like Lipitor, Zocor or Crestor.

Allan (26:16):
I agree. Another thing that we do now that we didn't do then, we avoid the sun. We slather on sunscreen because we don't want to get the skin cancer. But we need sunshine.

Dr. Berry (26:33):
Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. I have a chapter in the book about that sun lights and getting a healthy tan is in no way a risk factor for skin cancer. Absolutely not. The research done on this is just laughable. It's embarrassing that when, I mean dermatologists are some of the smartest doctors out there. In med school, you had to have almost a perfect 4.0 to even be considered for a dermatology residency, so these people started out, they were the cream of the cream in medical school and now just to say something as dumb as stay out of the sun or you'll get skin cancer. It's just, it's ludicrous. A lot of the research done on that was done on donated foreskins, so when a little baby boy is circumcised. They would do little research studies on that. Looking for markers that they decided were markers of a precancerous condition.

Dr. Berry (27:31):
The little foreskins didn't develop skin cancer. That's not what happened. They just had this marker that marker go up a little bit when exposed to UV radiation. And so they decided that meant that it's going to cause skin cancer. I mean all, there's just so many things I talk about in the book that just make this a ridiculous lie that doctors tell patients the sun protectors, the blockers, the SPF, what is it, up to 250 now SPF two 50 or something, I don't know. These things are full of, some of them are full of very worrisome chemicals that if you put the size of these on your small child, you can actually detect these chemicals in your child's bloodstream minutes later. There's a study published just recently about that. You're going to slash your child's ability to make vitamin D if you slather this sunscreen on them.

Dr. Berry (28:21):
Maybe exposed them to chemicals that are not good for them. And I definitely don't want your child to get a sunburn. Absolutely not. Because first of all, it hurts and pain is a feedback that we have developed to show, yeah, that's dumb. Don't do that anymore. But getting a healthy tan, getting your vitamin D from the sun, and who knows what else we get from the sun Allan. Because basically back in the late sixties and early seventies when it became the trope, Oh, skin sun exposure causes skin cancer. Just imagine if you'd been a young researcher at Harvard and you'd went to your chairman said, Hey, I want to do a study. I think that we probably use the sun for other things besides just making vitamin D. I'd love to expose people to UV radiation and see what that does to other levels in their body. Do you understand you would have been kicked out of the chairman's office and probably released from your duties?

Dr. Berry (29:13):
It was just, it's an studyable at this point in the, in the higher institutions of learning because it's considered central science that the sun causes cancer, but nothing can be further from the truth and so many of the carnivores play in the sun in their loine cloth every day in their skin looks amazing. They don't have skin cancer. Actually. People who work at the equator, and this is not dark skin people, this is even light-skinned people. They have less melanoma, which is the worst skin cancer, than people who are fully clothed and live in Norway. So you can't say, you just can't say that sun exposure causes cancer. It's a dumb thing to say. And I in the, in the chapter in the book actually give people the email address for the two largest dermatological societies. And I said, email them and ask them, send me the research study that shows that sun exposure increases my risk of cancer. And so many people have messaged me and said, you know, I didn't get anything or I got the foreskin study, which doesn't prove anything. And so literally that's what it's based on.

Allan (30:17):
Yeah. I had dr Dallas Harwich on not long ago, and one of the things that he kind of gets into is that, you know, we talk about light exposure at night being a problem for our sleep, but he proposes that getting out into the sun, getting out into open air, blue skies, on a regular basis during the day is actually very important for us to maintain a good solid circadian rhythm.

Dr. Berry (30:42):
Absolutely.

Allan (30:42):
You know, and so that in and of itself is just saying you need to be outside getting some of that light exposure to set everything in place for you to get a good night's sleep, for you to build your hormones and all the good stuff that happens to us when we go through really good sleep cycles. So that's even another thing, is get outside and do some things. Now what I've found is, is yeah, if you go out there the first day and you stay out for six hours in the sun, you're going to get a sunburn. But if you get some exposure and pull back, get some exposure and pull back, you tan and you get used to that exposure and it's like, like a muscle. You just build a capacity to be out in the sun longer and longer and not burn.

Dr. Berry (31:25):
And I'll tell you something very interesting, Allan, that I've noticed in my own personal health journey. And then hundreds of other people have said, you know, that same thing happened to me. I thought I was crazy, but maybe not. Back when I was just eating just the standard American inflammatory diet, I couldn't stay out in the direct sun on a beach at, at the latitude of, you know, Florida, Tampa Bay, Panama city. If I stayed out for 10 minutes, one minute longer, I was going to get a sunburn and I almost could not build up, I couldn't build the extra melanin and build up the tolerance. So the sun and I was the guy who would tell my phone, hey, wake me up in 10 minutes. And then I would go play with the kids for 10 minutes and then I had to go get to the umbrella or the rest of the vacation would be ruined because I'd be crybabying about my sunburn.

Dr. Berry (32:12):
As I converted to paleo and then to real whole food Tito, I'm not a big keto product fan. I want you to eat real whole one ingredient foods. I noticed that I could stay in the sun longer without burning. I noticed that I tan better and I'm like, maybe it's all of the bright green colors, all the beta carotene or something in the vegetables, but back, what's it been 15 months now when I, did that first carnivore month challenge on my Facebook group and said, Hey guys, let's see nothing of fatty meat for a month and see what happens. When I started the carnivore diet, I can stay out in the sun five times longer now without burning. I can develop a radiant tan and I just, I thought I was permanently fish belly color. I didn't think I can tan back in the day. Now I can develop a good healthy tan. It's much harder for me to burn in the sun now than it was 10 years ago.

Dr. Berry (33:12):
And when I started, when I said that on a podcast, I had multiple people reach out to me who were eating fatty, fatty meat, heavy keto or carnivores, and say, yes, 100% that happened to me too. And so now my current theory is, is that basically every cell in your skin has a cell membrane, right? And if you're eating enough fatty meats to build that cell membrane out of good cholesterol and good fatty acids, then that sale is actually able to function better than a sale that's built out of canola oil and all the other inflammatory crap that we eat. And I've noticed that personally and have had hundreds of other people verify, yep, I had the same thing happen to me. And indeed, if you look at most carnivores, they're always very tan and it looks like that their son is just much more able to use the powerful tool of sunlight to actually optimize their health instead of burning them.

Allan (34:10):
There's, there's one other thing I wanted to talk to you about before you have to go. I was sitting there with this guy. I mean we were talking and of course it comes up who I am and what I do. I own a gym and I do fitness stuff and so that's going to be where the conversation, 99% of the time it's going to go when I'm sitting down with someone and he said, you know, you said I was exercising and I lost all that weight and then I stopped exercising and I've gained it all back and he says, I need to get back to exercising. So I'll lose that weight. And you know, I put up my hand and I said, its what you're putting in your mouth, exercise. And you talk about this in the book. Can you go into a little bit more detail there?

Dr. Berry (34:50):
Yeah. Exercise. I think exercise is like sunlight, Allan. I think it does hundreds of beneficial things for the human body and the human mind. It's a powerful, powerful tool that we should all use regularly. But if you are overweight, obese or morbidly obese, exercise is a terrible method for losing fat. And that's been born out in multiple huge studies, the women's health initiative study, like calorie restricted for a long period of time. And so calorie restriction can either be from burning more or from eating less. So either way that's you're supposed to wind up with a calorie deficit. That's how weight loss is supposed to happen. And indeed, if I lock in that barn of mine Allan, and I starve you, you're definitely going to lose weight. But it's not going to be just fat.

Dr. Berry (35:44):
You can also lose muscle mass. You're going to lose cartilage density, you're going to lose fast or density, you're going to lose bone density. But nobody wants that. When, when we all say, when every one of us say, I want to lose some weight, what we actually meant to say was I want to lose some of this stored energy, some of this fat. That's what I want to lose. To do that, you have to change your diet. And I applaud you for being a gym owner and saying, Hey, Bubba, exercising aint going to help you lose fat. You go fix your diet to lose the fat. Now if you want to increase your endurance and you want to increase your your muscle, then yeah, get the gym. But if you're just trying to lose fat, step one is always, always, always without exception, fix your diet. That's how you lose the fat and how you lose most of the inflammation.

Allan (36:31):
Yeah and I'll tell him then the next step is whole foods. You know, just, just whole food. I don't know many people who eat a whole food diet that really have a weight problem.

Dr. Berry (36:42):
Exactly right. And that's, and you see this often in the vegans, especially now not in the vegetarians are eating lots of whole grains and lots of processed crap. But in a true whole food vegan, they're just not obese. Now they may still be pre diabetic or type two diabetic. They may still be quite inflamed, but they're skinny. And that's because you just can't eat enough whole foods to get fat. It's just, it's very, very difficult to do that. You have to eat to discomfort in order to do that, but eating processed foods, Oh, it's very easy to eat and put on too much fat.

Allan (37:16):
Absolutely. I define wellness as being the healthiest, fittest, and happiest you can be. What are three strategies or tactics to get and well?

Dr. Berry (37:27):
You got to fix your diet first and foremost. If you're not prepared to eat a proper human diet, then just forget all the rest of it and go watch TV. I don't know what to tell you, but when you're ready to actually achieve good health, then you've got to fix your diet. Number one. That's 90% of the battle is fixing your diet .and whether that is an OVO lacto pescatarian ketogenic diet or whether that is a 100% fatty red meat carnivore diet, I consider all those to be on the spectrum of what I call the proper human diet. That's number one. Number two, then you work on your lifestyle. You work on getting that morning sun, you work on getting your bedroom exactly perfect so that you can get the best sleep of your life. You start working out whether that's going for a walk or whether that's trying to beat your PR on the, on the deadlift, the lifestyle's number two. And then number three plus or minus maybe a few supplements if you're up in, you know, I recommend almost everybody over 40 should probably take a little coenzyme QT and unless they're a carnival workers, you're, you're to get plenty of that.

Dr. Berry (38:35):
Especially if you're a nose to tail carnivore. But most people probably need some coenzyme QT after the age of 40 a lot of people who live at the Northern latitudes probably need some vitamin D. but, so a lot of people want to start. Alan was step three. Oh, let me buy a bunch of supplements. Yeah. Waste of time. Waste of money. A lot of people want to start with step two, let me join the gym. Let me, cause I feel like if I'm paying that monthly fee that will make me…no, no, that's, that's, you're just, that's not ever gonna happen. Step one, every single time is fix your damn food. Eat only real whole one ingredient foods. If it has more than three ingredients on the package, don't even pick it up. And really, if it has a package, don't pick it up.

Dr. Berry (39:22):
That's not real food. That's a food like product that a big food corporation has manufactured to get your five bucks. That's all that is. Okay. And I've been saying for a few years now, I don't, I think that the food, big food manufacturing is going to crater. There's gonna be tons of bankruptcies because there is no real whole food ketogenic product that you can stock on a store shelf that's going to, that you can make in China and ship in a container ship that's going to be shelf stable for two years. Real food don't act like that. And everybody in the keto and carnivores space right now are, they're just trying their best to come up with a keto product or a carnival product. But every single time they do it has to be processed. It has to have extra crap added to it and it's even got a very short, short half life, which means it's still real food or it's turned into a Franken food like product that's just they're after your money.

Allan (40:21):
Yeah, I would, I would just put my money into something like Maria Emmerich's keto cookbooks or something like that.

Dr. Berry (40:30):
Start raising chicken, start raising cows that there'll be some money to make in that, but there won't be billions and billions of dollars to be made in that, and that's what everybody's looking for is a product that can scale up and make $1 billion. It's just not going to happen in the keto carnivores space because we real food here. We don't want your products.

Allan (40:50):
Yeah, I completely agree with you. So thank you doctor. If someone wanted to learn more about you, learn more about your book, Lies My Doctor Told Me, where would you like for me to send them?

Dr. Berry (41:02):
Lies My Doctor Told Me, is available as a paperback, as a Kindle and Audible wherever fine books are sold. I have a little YouTube channel that I've got I think over 270 videos that you can watch for nothing that's absolutely free to watch them all.

Dr. Berry (41:19):
If you just go to YouTube and search for Dr. Berry, you should find me. Dr. Berry Keto, Dr. Berry Carnivore, Dr. Berry, thyroid, testosterone. I talk about all this stuff on the YouTube channel, even toenail fungus. That's one of my biggest videos is how to reverse and cure toenail fungus and never get it again. And that video has been viewed over 2 million times, so it must be, there must be some truth in it. I've got a Facebook page where my wife, Nisha and I, we go live every Monday night. So this is, we're doing this on a Monday, so it's 7 PM central. We go live and talk about the latest news articles and the latest silliness in the news and in the media. And then we all answered a bunch of people's questions. I'm also on Instagram. I'm on Twitter. I'm even on Tik Toc Allan cause I'm trying to go grab those young kids before they develop metabolic syndrome.

Allan (42:09):
That's perfect. You can go to 40plusfitnesspodcast.com/430 and I'll be sure to have links there. Dr. Barry, thank you so much for being a part of 40+ Fitness.

Dr. Berry (42:20):
It was a pleasure. Allan, I'll be back anytime you need me.

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